Ok no replication available. You are aware that Robert Wood in 1909 performed an experiment counter to Arrhenius, which has been replicated?
I then asked:
Does the GHE behave like that of a real glass greenhouse?
Your reply:
No, of course not. Everyone knows that. Do you have a point? It seems you are taking a dislike to the terminology as opposed to adding to the discussion. Would you prefer it if we called it the Furdoop Effect? We could, but it wouldn't change a thing.
Why do so many science institutions claim that CO2 "traps heat" like a real glass greenhouse?
What are you going on about? I looked up Wood's experiment and the 2011 verification. It was a total waste of time. Nobody in their right mind believes that CO2 works like glass. Wood's experiment may have been of utility (or not) in the era, but today it is laughable to perform. Your claim that many science institutions claim that CO2 acts like glass is astounding. You are being a simpleton, conflating terminology to be a description of how things work. Since you are so big on proper cites, please show a non-soundbite example. If you bother to read the literature, any literature, it is quite plainly stated everywhere that the analogy is just an analogy, not a proper description of how it works. Crowing that the analogy isn't perfect is just throwing ____.
Oh, and you claim that Woods refutes Arrhenius. I assume you mean that Arrhenius thought that CO2 acts like glass. Please show some evidence for such an incredible claim, Mr Cites.
What are you going on about? I looked up Wood's experiment and the 2011 verification. It was a total waste of time.
Was it this one?
principia-scientific.org/publications/Experiment_on_Greenhouse_Effect.pdfNow explain to me, in detail, how it is a waste of time. You can't find a replication by any source to validate Arrhenius? It's always fun when people use the same talking points. The Woods experiment was precisely to refute the notion the earth's atmosphere behaved like a "real glass greenhouse". In fact, it was an experiment that tested the hypothesis of how a real glass greenhouse works. You doubt me?
From the Woods Hole Research Center:
www.whrc.org/resources/primer_greenhouse.htmlIs that the correct description of the "greenhouse effect"?
"Trapping heat" from both government, NGO, science and education outlets.
earthguide.ucsd.edu/virtualmuseum/rotary/global_warming/03.shtmlCarbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas – it traps heat radiation that is attempting to escape from Earth.
archive.greenpeace.org/climate/science/reports/climatefaq.htmlSimilarly, the earth is surrounded by a blanket of gases. This blanket traps energy in the atmosphere, much the same way as glass traps heat inside a greenhouse. This results in an accumulation of energy, and the overall warming of the atmosphere. The 'greenhouse effect' is the popular expression for the above process.
www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/caer/ce/eek/earth/air/global.htmThink of the earth as being inside a giant greenhouse. The gases act like a greenhouse's glass walls -- they keep heat from escaping into space, and the earth stays warm.
Try this easy experiment: Take two jars and put a teaspoon of water in each jar. Put a lid on just one jar. Place both jars in a sunny spot. After a few hours, check on the jars. You'll see that the open jar hasn't changed, but the closed jar will be steamy and hot inside. What happened? The heat from the sun could not escape from the closed jar.
www.theweatherchannelkids.com/climate-code/climate-close-up/greenhouse-gases/What is the Greenhouse Effect? The greenhouse effect is a process that helps keep the Earth warm enough for people, plants and animals to live on. Think of the Earth like a giant greenhouse. Imagine the Earth’s atmosphere like the glass of a greenhouse. Both the gases of our atmosphere and the glass of a greenhouse trap the sun’s heat energy inside keeping the temperature balanced; not too hot or too cold. This is why some of the gases in our atmosphere are called “greenhouse gases”.
And a long list I've collected over time from previous posts on this subject. Now you're going to say with a straight face the Woods experiment is a waste of time? You are a dope. Read the following then come back and tell me there isn't a relationship between the "greenhouse effect" and a real glass greenhouse. It is not just an analogy; it is based on how Tyndall and Arrhenius et al described it.
Prove me wrong.
Bigelow Laboratory for Ocean Sciences
In a greenhouse, visible light (e.g., from the Sun) easily penetrates glass or plastic walls, but heat (in the form of infrared radiation) does not. The greenhouse effect refers to the physical process by which atmospheric gases allow sunlight to pass through but absorb infrared radiation thus acting like a blanket trapping heat.
www.bigelow.org/virtual/handson/greenhouse_make.htmlThe U.S. government's Environmental Protection Agency
The energy that is absorbed is converted in part to heat energy that is re-radiated back into the atmosphere. Heat energy waves are not visible, and are generally in the infrared (long-wavelength) portion of the spectrum compared to visible light. Physical laws show that atmospheric constituents— notably water vapor and carbon dioxide gas—that are transparent to visible light are not transparent to heat waves. Hence, re-radiated energy in the infrared portion of the spectrum is trapped within the atmosphere, keeping the surface temperature warm. This phenomenon is called the "greenhouse effect" because it is exactly the same principle that heats a greenhouse
www.epa.gov/ne/students/pdfs/activ13.pdfFort Lewis College, Colorado
This partial trapping of solar radiation is known as the greenhouse effect. The name comes from the fact that a very similar process operates in a greenhouse. Sunlight passes relatively unhindered through glass panes, but much of the infrared radiation reemitted by the plants is blocked by the glass and cannot get out. Consequently, the interior of the greenhouse heats up, and flowers, fruits, and vegetables can grow even on cold wintry days.
physics.fortlewis.edu/Astronomy/astronomy%20today/CHAISSON/AT307/HTML/AT30702.HTMPlanet Connecticut.org
Glass is transparent to sunlight, but is effectively opaque to infrared radiation. Therefore, the glass warms up when it absorbs some of the infrared radiation that is radiated by the ground, water, and biomass. The glass will then re-radiate this heat as infrared radiation, some to the outside and some back into the greenhouse. The energy radiated back into the greenhouse causes the inside of the greenhouse to heat up.
www.planetconnecticut.org/teachersadministrators/pdfs/lesson1.pdfUnited Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change
Greenhouse gases make up only about 1 per cent of the atmosphere, but they act like a blanket around the earth, or like the glass roof of a greenhouse -- they trap heat and keep the planet some 30 degrees C warmer than it would be otherwise.
unfccc.int/essential_background/feeling_the_heat/items/2903.phpNASA
The "greenhouse effect" is the warming of climate that results when the atmosphere traps heat radiating from Earth toward space. Certain gases in the atmosphere resemble glass in a greenhouse,
allowing sunlight to pass into the "greenhouse," but blocking Earth's heat from escaping into space.
www.gsfc.nasa.gov/gsfc/service/gallery/fact_sheets/earthsci/green.htmNASA
Why is this process called "The Greenhouse Effect?"
Because the same process keeps glass-covered greenhouses warm. The Sun heats the ground and greenery inside the greenhouse, but the glass absorbs the re-radiated infra-red and returns some of it to the inside.
www-istp.gsfc.nasa.gov/stargaze/Lsun1lit.htmNASA
A real greenhouse is made of glass, which lets visible sunlight through from the outside. This light gets absorbed by all the materials inside, and the warmed surfaces radiate infrared light, sometimes called "heat rays", back. But the glass, although transparent to visible light, acts as a partial barrier to the infrared light. So some of this infrared radiation, or heat, gets trapped inside.
www-airs.jpl.nasa.gov/News/Features/FeaturesClimateChange/GreenhouseEffect/Dept of Atmospheric and Oceanic Science at the University of Maryland
A real greenhouse is enclosed by glass walls and ceilings. Glass is highly transparent in the visible wavelengths of the sun, so sunlight freely passes into the greenhouse. However, glass is highly absorbing in the infrared wavelengths characteristic of emission by earth's surface. Therefore, the infrared radiation emitted by the surface is efficiently absorbed by the glass walls and ceiling, and these surfaces, in turn, radiate energy back into the interior of the greenhouse, as well as outward to the environment. But clearly, a large portion of the infrared radiation from the surface does not pass outward from the greenhouse, and the equivalent energy is contained within the greenhouse environment.
www.atmos.umd.edu/~owen/CHPI/IMAGES/grnhs1.htmlHow Stuff Works
Light passes through the glass into the greenhouse and heats things up inside the greenhouse. The glass is then opaque to the infrared energy these heated things are emitting, so the heat is trapped inside the greenhouse.
home.howstuffworks.com/question238.htmEnviropedia.org.uk
Greenhouse gases like water vapour, carbon dioxide, methane and nitrous oxide trap the infrared radiation released by the Earth's surface. The atmosphere acts like the glass in a greenhouse, allowing much of the shortwave solar radiation to travel through unimpeded, but trapping a lot of the longwave heat energy trying to escape back to space. This process makes the temperature rise in the atmosphere just as it does in the greenhouse. This is the Earth's natural greenhouse effect and keeps the Earth 33°C warmer than it would be without an atmosphere, at an average 15°C. In contrast, the moon, which has no atmosphere, has an average surface temperature of -18°C.
www.enviropedia.org.uk/Climate_Change/Greenhouse_Effect.phpUniversity of Alaska-Fairbanks, Physics Department
Greenhouse gases act as a blanket. Some of you may wonder how a green house takes solar energy and turns it into thermal energy. A good example of this is something you can observe every day in the summer in you own car. It happens when you leave you car in a sunny parking lot with the windows up. The solar energy is passing through the glass and is heating the cars interior. What’s really happening is the short wave infrared waves are going in and are turning into long wave infrared waves, which cannot escape.
ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/102spring2002_Web_projects/C.Levit/web%20page.htmlClimate.org
Fortunately, much of this infrared radiation is absorbed in the atmosphere by the so-called greenhouse gases, making the world much warmer than it would be without them. These gases act rather like the glass in a greenhouse, which allows sunlight to enter, provides shelter from the wind and prevents most of the infrared energy from escaping, keeping the temperature warm.
www.climate.org.ua/ghg/ghgeffect.htmlState of Utah Office of Education
On a global scale, carbon dioxide, water vapor, and other gases present in the atmosphere are similar to the glass in a greenhouse. Ultraviolet radiation from the sun (having a short wavelength) can pass through the glass. Once inside the greenhouse, the ultraviolet radiation is absorbed by soils, plants, and other objects. Upon absorption, it becomes infrared radiation or heat energy having a shorter wavelength. Because of this, infrared radiation cannot escape through the windows. The windows act
like a large blanket in which they reradiate the infrared energy back into the greenhouse. This phenomenon naturally causes the overall temperature within the greenhouse to increase.
www.usoe.k12.ut.us/curr/science/core/earth/sciber9/Stand_6/html/1e.htmG.H.P. Dharmaratna, Director General Department of Meteorology
In order to understand the greenhouse effect on earth a good place to start is in a greenhouse. A greenhouse is kept warm because energy coming in from the sun (in the form of visible sunlight) is able to pass easily through the glass of the greenhouse and heat the soil and plants inside. But energy which is emitted from the soil and plants is in the form of invisible infrared radiation; this is not able to pass as easily through the glass of the greenhouse. Some of the infrared heat energy is trapped inside; this is the main reason why a greenhouse is warmer than outside.
www.lankajalani.org/Publications/Paper%20-%20Impacts%20of%20Climate%20Change.docWeather-Climate.org
This warming effect is called the "greenhouse effect" because it is the same process as that which occurs in a greenhouse on a sunny day. The glass is transparent to short-wave radiation but absorbs the outgoing long-wave radiation, causing a rise in temperature inside the greenhouse.
www.weather-climate.org.uk/04.phpEduhistory.com
The glass used for a greenhouse acts as a selective transmission medium for different spectral frequencies, and its effect is to trap energy within the greenhouse, which heats both the plants and the ground inside it. This warms the air near the ground, and this air is prevented from rising and flowing away. This can be demonstrated by opening a small window near the roof of a greenhouse: the temperature drops considerably. Greenhouses thus work by trapping electromagnetic radiation and preventing convection.
www.eduhistory.com/greenhouse.htmNorthwestern University, Evanston, Illinois
Overview: Carbon Dioxide is identified as “greenhouse gas” because of its ability to trap heat within earth’s environment. ...Explain that the greenhouse effect works in a somewhat similar -- but not entirely the same -- way (see teacher notes and background supplement sheet for more information). The sun’s rays pass through the atmosphere and warm the surface. The earth emits some of this energy back into space (like heat from a campfire). But gases such as carbon dioxide and water vapor (in clouds) absorb much of this energy and send it back to earth. People have come to call this process the “greenhouse effect” because it reminds them of how actual greenhouses, which are made out of glass and grow plants, let the sun’s rays in while trapping much of the radiation that would otherwise
escape.
www.letus.northwestern.edu/projects/gw/pdf/C09.pdfSo, let's hear your rendition of how a "real glass greenhouse" works!