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Post by nautonnier on Oct 14, 2015 13:21:37 GMT
There have been abrupt changes in the past well before human industry added around 4ppm to the 400ppm in the atmosphere. Trees and plants even flowers recovered as ice melts so sudden and continual snows have happened. So it is a problem but the problem is of a natural change that out power and money hungry politicians have no capability of preventing or even ameliorating. Imagine say next year the snow in North America and Europe does not melt as expected it is still piled high in July (some almost made that last year) then the snow comes early at the end of August and lands on those piles. In Canada and Russia some croplands never become tillable. The next winter is again cold with more snow and this time in 2017 laying snow does not melt until August and it starts snowing again by late August. Large populations of people start migrating south. ..... Now tell me how much tax on CO2 and solar cell subsidies will ameliorate that 'abrupt' climate change? What are _any_ politicians doing that would in any way assist? By then the UN may have imposed a world government that will be totally ignored by starving hordes of migrants moving south. Power grids will have died along with 75% of populations in large towns like New York, London, Beijing. Tell me anyone - what will our politicians and their friends in Gioldman Sachs (creating all that lucre for themselves before the power goes down and the electronic money ceases to have meaning) - what will they do? I really think that these people have such hubris they think they are any better than King Knut?
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Post by missouriboy on Oct 14, 2015 16:47:01 GMT
There have been abrupt changes in the past well before human industry added around 4ppm to the 400ppm in the atmosphere. Trees and plants even flowers recovered as ice melts so sudden and continual snows have happened. So it is a problem but the problem is of a natural change that out power and money hungry politicians have no capability of preventing or even ameliorating. Imagine say next year the snow in North America and Europe does not melt as expected it is still piled high in July (some almost made that last year) then the snow comes early at the end of August and lands on those piles. In Canada and Russia some croplands never become tillable. The next winter is again cold with more snow and this time in 2017 laying snow does not melt until August and it starts snowing again by late August. Large populations of people start migrating south. ..... Now tell me how much tax on CO2 and solar cell subsidies will ameliorate that 'abrupt' climate change? What are _any_ politicians doing that would in any way assist? By then the UN may have imposed a world government that will be totally ignored by starving hordes of migrants moving south. Power grids will have died along with 75% of populations in large towns like New York, London, Beijing. Tell me anyone - what will our politicians and their friends in Gioldman Sachs (creating all that lucre for themselves before the power goes down and the electronic money ceases to have meaning) - what will they do? I really think that these people have such hubris they think they are any better than King Knut? They'll be the first ones in the south land ... and the US Army (or Haliburton mercenaries) will be guarding their residences and their vaults. They were only in it for the money anyway. They used to be called carpetbaggers. The southern cross may fly again.
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Post by graywolf on Jan 28, 2016 11:09:34 GMT
Bump!!! Just thought we might need this over the coming 12 months?
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Post by walnut on Jan 28, 2016 13:52:29 GMT
Why, is it about to get abruptly cold? The sun is about to go into hibernation.
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Post by missouriboy on Jan 28, 2016 14:04:21 GMT
It may depend on how broadly you define climate. But Europe seems to be experiencing one of those mass movement things? It's coming out of the East and Southeast ... the same direction as came the Huns and the Mongols and the last wave of the 'Religion of Peace'. Hunger comes in many forms.
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Post by graywolf on Jan 28, 2016 14:25:41 GMT
As I understand things Mother N. keeps nature as stable as She is able within 2 extremes. Push one way and she deploys checks and balances to drag it back to the mean and keep us within the 'stable zone' in which civilisation flourished. Push her hard in one direction and , eventually, She will flip to the next 'stable' climate setting.
Over the past two decades a concoction of human induced dimming ( mainly from Indo-China) and Nature's last ditch efforts to control things we saw warming rates drop back from those of the 80's/90's. Over the past few years I believe we have begun to see Mother Nature concede that She can no longer maintain the climate we flourished in. Sadly China has also begun to make inroads into lessening their 'dirty pollution'to bring an end to the thousands of deaths it was inflicting on their city dwellers.
To me this means that whilst Mother N. is bust allowing climate to step up to the next 'stable' point she can hold stable we have put further forcings on the climate system by 'cleaning up our acts'.
As such we will see rapid climate oscillations across the globe as the added energy added to the system finds expression in ever more extreme weather events/stuck weather patterns.
The first thing you might choose to note will be the lack of Nina following this Nino with no fall back in temps lower than 2014?
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Post by walnut on Jan 28, 2016 14:34:52 GMT
This climate change thingy is just taking tooo long. I am shocked that we are not all dead by now.. shocked I tell ya.
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Post by nautonnier on Jan 28, 2016 16:13:12 GMT
As I understand things Mother N. keeps nature as stable as She is able within 2 extremes. Push one way and she deploys checks and balances to drag it back to the mean and keep us within the 'stable zone' in which civilisation flourished. Push her hard in one direction and , eventually, She will flip to the next 'stable' climate setting. Over the past two decades a concoction of human induced dimming ( mainly from Indo-China) and Nature's last ditch efforts to control things we saw warming rates drop back from those of the 80's/90's. Over the past few years I believe we have begun to see Mother Nature concede that She can no longer maintain the climate we flourished in. Sadly China has also begun to make inroads into lessening their 'dirty pollution'to bring an end to the thousands of deaths it was inflicting on their city dwellers. To me this means that whilst Mother N. is bust allowing climate to step up to the next 'stable' point she can hold stable we have put further forcings on the climate system by 'cleaning up our acts'. As such we will see rapid climate oscillations across the globe as the added energy added to the system finds expression in ever more extreme weather events/stuck weather patterns. The first thing you might choose to note will be the lack of Nina following this Nino with no fall back in temps lower than 2014? By definition one cannot see repeated climate oscillations, that is weather. In the current jet stream system see earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/isobaric/250hPa/orthographic=-49.23,41.32,428 it would appear that the jet streams in the Northern Hemisphere instead of the orderly polar jet and sub-tropical jet have become so meridonal that they are mixing air as far down as northern South America. The storm 'Jonas' had a cold front that trailed from Nova Scotia to Venezuela following the line of the mixed meridonal jets. The reason for the extreme changeable weather with Taiwan and South Korea getting severe cold and Finland being warm is these meridonal jet streams. The Hadley cells do not appear to have any strength to them at all allowing the jet streams to move equatorward. The extra cloudiness will lead to reduction in SSTs and things will start getting colder. Don't sell your coat - tm Harold Ambler
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Post by acidohm on Jan 28, 2016 17:04:36 GMT
As I understand things Mother N. keeps nature as stable as She is able within 2 extremes. Push one way and she deploys checks and balances to drag it back to the mean and keep us within the 'stable zone' in which civilisation flourished. Push her hard in one direction and , eventually, She will flip to the next 'stable' climate setting. Over the past two decades a concoction of human induced dimming ( mainly from Indo-China) and Nature's last ditch efforts to control things we saw warming rates drop back from those of the 80's/90's. Over the past few years I believe we have begun to see Mother Nature concede that She can no longer maintain the climate we flourished in. Sadly China has also begun to make inroads into lessening their 'dirty pollution'to bring an end to the thousands of deaths it was inflicting on their city dwellers. To me this means that whilst Mother N. is bust allowing climate to step up to the next 'stable' point she can hold stable we have put further forcings on the climate system by 'cleaning up our acts'. As such we will see rapid climate oscillations across the globe as the added energy added to the system finds expression in ever more extreme weather events/stuck weather patterns. The first thing you might choose to note will be the lack of Nina following this Nino with no fall back in temps lower than 2014? Lack of any Nina??? If we get one.....will you change your position on all of the above?? Also, lets not get too excited about record high temps...error bars alone make it hard to distinguish between highs, let alone all the extra controversy about how they are recorded etc... wattsupwiththat.com/2016/01/27/final-2015-statistics-now-includes-december-data/
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Post by icefisher on Jan 29, 2016 12:01:50 GMT
one thing for sure we are plus 30 years out from the models teaching us anything. no doubt this is why the propaganda machine has been cranking it up.
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Post by sigurdur on Apr 16, 2016 17:37:18 GMT
www.npr.org/2016/04/16/474395637/what-can-we-learn-from-early-floridians-on-sea-level-riseMillions of years of Florida's history are lying on a table in Paulette McFadden's office at the University of Florida in Gainesville. It's in long metal tubes containing several feet of sediment from Horseshoe Beach, a community on Florida's Gulf coast. "This core," McFadden says, "actually spans about 30 million years." McFadden, a geoarchaeologist, examines Florida's first human settlements. At the bottom of the core are limestone and fossils from the Eocene epoch. From the cores she examines, McFadden sees the beginning of big changes around 450 B.C.
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Post by nautonnier on Apr 17, 2016 16:53:57 GMT
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Post by sigurdur on Apr 17, 2016 17:32:20 GMT
Sea levels have been rising for years? I thought only recently that AGW caused "C" levels to rise? Gosh.....I read a lot, how could I have been so out of the loop?
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Post by acidohm on Apr 17, 2016 18:34:05 GMT
Sea levels have been rising for years? I thought only recently that AGW caused "C" levels to rise? Gosh.....I read a lot, how could I have been so out of the loop? Easily done Sig, unless you've got a PhD and learnt the handshake
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Post by nautonnier on Apr 18, 2016 14:20:34 GMT
Sea levels have been rising for years? I thought only recently that AGW caused "C" levels to rise? Gosh.....I read a lot, how could I have been so out of the loop? Easily done Sig, unless you've got a PhD and learnt the handshake That's why together with the clever handshake they roll up their trouser legs - preparation for sea level rise!
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