An Electrifying Question

[elien]

Sept 30, 2008 8:37:35 GMT Acolyte said:

Sept 30, 2008 8:34:41 GMT elien said:

Try and find the thread. I didn't insult anyone so I'd like it back and locked. No prob with that.



What evidence? IT WAS DELETED

Calmly send a PM to a moderator - I'm just a member.

As for evidence, you can search, find & link. You have the internet at your service & you have obviously spent some time developing your ideas. Show us why they're more than random speculations.

Ehm, the mods took down the thread. After asking the other participant to quiet down so attention would be diverted. That's the definition of weasly fascism. Even if I post again, it will be taken down, that's how it works. The internet is supposed to be open not a journal for elitist brats

[Acolyte]

Hey elien, if you have a link to info that shows Tesla's broadcast power idea got past the initial setup I'd be fascinated. As far as I knew he was still in set up phase when it blew - in fact that was one of the mysteries that was evidence he was on to something - nobody could work out how it blew up, unless he was actually using power at a level higher than was expected.

Personally i found it a puzzle as to why sabotage wasn't brought forward as an hypothesis; Edison was heading down a dead end & was far enough along to know it.

As for the forum stuff, I posted in that thread reluctantly. It was already heading down the path of acrimony and vitriol. If you really feel you've been hard done by, PM to Kevin asking for an explanation. These forums seem fairly open & balanced to me; I find it difficult to believe things would have been handled as one-sidedly as you are implying.

As for believing in freedom of speech, most of the western world experiences daily more freedom of speech than is allowed in the US, so yes, we understand about it. But in a forums environment it is better to think of it as being in someone else's lounge room. We are allowed to come & partake, but it isn't our house, our decor or our rules.

Try this... when you feel the anger or upset rising, STOP, step away from the keyboard and breathe by pushing your belly out to suck in a lungful of air. Then use your belly to push it all out. Repeat. repeat again until you've had time to think things over. Just how much impact on your life will the opinion or the vitriol of the person to whom you reacted actually have on your life? How much will it matter if s/he doesn't really like you? Ditto if they don't agree with you?

Now come back and post. Post what you wish to say, not what they have made you say by pushing your buttons.

Now... about my questions about Tunguska...?

[Acolyte]

Output is cosmic/galactic/solar rays. High frequency current. It alternates because of the planetary capacitor resistance as per the capacitor in AC formulas

High frequency current implies charge transactions doesn't it? For solar radiation to be described as AC, the charge transactions should be of both polarities.

When the sun blasts out plasma isn't it a mix of positive & negative? Are you suggesting the differing masses spearate out the ions to cause a timing differential? While that would deliver a peak negative followed by a peak positive, I don't see that it would produce AC.

How does planetary capacitance cause an alternating current? My understanding is capacitance is a storage of charge, not a generation function.

[elien]

Sept 30, 2008 12:19:38 GMT Acolyte said:

Hey elien, if you have a link to info that shows Tesla's broadcast power idea got past the initial setup I'd be fascinated. As far as I knew he was still in set up phase when it blew - in fact that was one of the mysteries that was evidence he was on to something - nobody could work out how it blew up, unless he was actually using power at a level higher than was expected.

He had demonstrated it and there are recordings of sky glows at the time.
It was foreclosed at 1908 yet he managed to fund and operate it till 1911.

As for the forum stuff, I posted in that thread reluctantly. It was already heading down the path of acrimony and vitriol. If you really feel you've been hard done by, PM to Kevin asking for an explanation. These forums seem fairly open & balanced to me; I find it difficult to believe things would have been handled as one-sidedly as you are implying.

Ok then I ask the mods to provide the thread so it can be examined.
Hiding the evidence and relying on faith doesn't cut it. We're scientists.

As for believing in freedom of speech, most of the western world experiences daily more freedom of speech than is allowed in the US, so yes, we understand about it. But in a forums environment it is better to think of it as being in someone else's lounge room. We are allowed to come & partake, but it isn't our house, our decor or our rules.

Sorry but my lounge isn't open for the public. That's a bad analogy.
They should change register to invite only if they don't have ideals.

Try this... when you feel the anger or upset rising, STOP, step away from the keyboard and breathe by pushing your belly out to suck in a lungful of air. Then use your belly to push it all out. Repeat. repeat again until you've had time to think things over. Just how much impact on your life will the opinion or the vitriol of the person to whom you reacted actually have on your life? How much will it matter if s/he doesn't really like you? Ditto if they don't agree with you?

Now come back and post. Post what you wish to say, not what they have made you say by pushing your buttons.

I'll do that, and post on other's threads. I'm probably on the way to ban heaven, I know.

High frequency current implies charge transactions doesn't it? For solar radiation to be described as AC, the charge transactions should be of both polarities.

When the sun blasts out plasma isn't it a mix of positive & negative? Are you suggesting the differing masses spearate out the ions to cause a timing differential? While that would deliver a peak negative followed by a peak positive, I don't see that it would produce AC.

Let's start with a basic premise, continuity. Reality isn't digital with either 0 or 1.
Particles are an illusion, there's constant exchange of charge. We round and tag.
The solar system is good analog for an atom and we know gaia constantly changes.
The planet receives from the "vacuum"(which isn't one) and gives back. There's flow.

How does planetary capacitance cause an alternating current? My understanding is capacitance is a storage of charge, not a generation function.

You can say that the voltage buildup causes it, which in turn comes from current.
In reality there's no such thing as cause or effect, just electrodynamic balancing.

[kaz]

Info on Tesla and the Tunguska incident at
www.viewzone.com/tesla.html
It indicates that both events occured on the same day.

[senorchuck]

" But in a forums environment it is better to think of it as being in someone else's lounge room. We are allowed to come & partake, but it isn't our house, our decor or our rules."

"Sorry but my lounge isn't open for the public. That's a bad analogy.
They should change register to invite only if they don't have ideals."

ELIEN, THIS IS KEVIN'S HOUSE. HE HAS MADE A LOVELY LOUNGE FOR US TO ENJOY. IF SOMEONE COMES IN AND DEFECATES ON THE FLOOR AND THE HOST, IN THE NAME OF FREE SPEECH, OR FOR ANY OTHER REASON, HE RUINS IT FOR ALL. STOP THE VITRIOL.

[Acolyte]

Sept 30, 2008 13:27:31 GMT kaz said:

Info on Tesla and the Tunguska incident at
www.viewzone.com/tesla.html
It indicates that both events occured on the same day.

That link brought a blank page but this one should take readers to the right page.

Interesting stuff... strange I never came across it back when i was reading about Tesla. Thanks for the prod elien & kaz

[npsguy]

Sept 30, 2008 8:40:22 GMT elien said:

Ehm, the mods took down the thread. After asking the other participant to quiet down so attention would be diverted. That's the definition of weasly fascism. Even if I post again, it will be taken down, that's how it works. The internet is supposed to be open not a journal for elitist brats

I don't know why the thread was taken down but I am going to guess it was MY posts and not yours that caused that to happen. Probably the 'tin foil' hat picture did it in.

However I don't think you should call the moderator/owner of this forum a elitist brat however nor a "weasley facist". See... the First amendment protects your free speech from the government... but not from forum moderators. It may do you some good to read up on that.

And remember... it was YOU who said the best "peer review" was by the Internet. Right?

Anyway I will stop there for now...

[elien]

Thank you, I really admire your stance. I'm not American but I feel that the 1st amendment isn't so much about the elegance of it's readout. The people who wrote it where genuinely concerned about their fellows(you too) rights and tried to predict. You can't blame them for not guessing everything. The internet is the most public of spaces. The only one where all people can really hang out without elitist divisions spoiling the fun. Mods are the highest of public servants and soon that will be formal

[npsguy]

Well you know... you can always create your own forum. There are free forum sites out there. There is freeforums.org for example.

Or you can make your own using open source software which is what I had done a while ago.

[Acolyte]

Hm... the Tesla test doesn't seem to have solid evidence as having occurred. Most sources seem to put it in the 'might have' category although the level of detail about wanting Peary in the Arctic to see the effects of the test seem strange.

If it happened, I wonder why it missed? I also wonder what the visible track across the sky might have been. Any way you look at it, it's a mysterious event but if it was Tesla, a couple of sources have him knowing about Tunguska before anyone ever went there to see what happened.

Interestingly, somewhere along the line I seem to be connecting Tesla & Leedskalnin, not physically but in that they both seem to have alternate ideas about how things are, & then set out to make changes in physical reality based on their ideas.

[ozone]

I love these myths that someone "discovered" new science a century, a millenium ago, promptly lost that knowledge, and it has never been rediscovered.
And I will believe them when HGW delivers me a time machine, or ERB takes me on a journey to the center of the Earth.
Oh, you say those are not good examples because they are fictional? I rest my case.

[elien]

Oct 1, 2008 14:34:05 GMT @ozone said:

I love these myths that someone "discovered" new science a century, a millenium ago, promptly lost that knowledge, and it has never been rediscovered.

A myth that gave us AC. And his research was confiscated.
And why was he documented in the Philadelphia project?

And I will believe them when HGW delivers me a time machine, or ERB takes me on a journey to the center of the Earth.
Oh, you say those are not good examples because they are fictional? I rest my case.

Will you believe it when Higgs finds his boson?
Don't tell me that we've wasted $6Bn dollars!

[Acolyte]

Oct 1, 2008 14:34:05 GMT @ozone said:

I love these myths that someone "discovered" new science a century, a millenium ago, promptly lost that knowledge, and it has never been rediscovered.
And I will believe them when HGW delivers me a time machine, or ERB takes me on a journey to the center of the Earth.
Oh, you say those are not good examples because they are fictional? I rest my case.

I know how you feel but there are some problems with that view in these cases - both men existed, both have proven their ideas with physical results. Coral Castle is still there so you can go stand in it & wonder just how one man, without major engineering tools, could accomplish what Leedskalnin did... twice!

Yes there may be people who now try to make them into mystical gurus or savants, but facts are facts. I'm not so sure about the testing coincidence of timing for the Tunguska stuff, but it's possible. Certainly Westinghouse believed in Tesla and something blew up his site.

Scepticism is a good healthy attitude but not when it leads to ignoring or not seeing reality. AGW'ers allow their beliefs that they know how things are to blind them (or maybe have more pragmatic motives) to reality, to where the evidence fails to match their models & we rightly take a stand they are off track with their 'sceince.'

But there are other fields where equally blinding beliefs conflict with reality and so questions are not asked or answers not found simply because 'it can't be so.'

Making 'conspiracy theorists' into a joke is probably the biggest conspiracy of all - and the most successful. Now we police ourselves, deciding on the basis of a label that a subject is ridiculous and backing away from those who may have perfectly justifiable reasons for thinking there's something strange going on.

Real science is about looking at what is really there - filtering it through preconceptions means we fail at real science.

For example, UFOs may or may not be alien spacecraft, but there's a slight fact being ignored or at least not being addressed fully because those who could are backing away & not making eye contact. The question is, why are hundreds of thousands of people having experineces that, in spite of the ridicule they attract, & knowing in advance they will attract that ridicule, having these experineces.

And if they have been having them throughout history, as some suggest as if that somehow makes it all OK, why do humans, normally rational people as well as strange ones, see these things?

Rupert Sheldrake has become fringe, yet he used perfectly valid science, from a science background, to reach his findings & his results keep getting ignored. Why? Because they are outside people's rpeconceived beliefs.

[kaidaw]

Science, almost by definition, requires that a phenomenon can be replicated (or successfully predicted, as appropriate) on demand, regardless of the predilection of the investigator.
And, never, never should we believe someone's claim in matter X' just because he appears to have been on target re matter X. That is not science.