Massive heat wave scorches central U.S. and expand

[scpg02]

Posted at 10:50 AM ET, 07/18/2011
Massive heat wave scorches central U.S. and expands east, as drought continues in South
By Andrew Freedman

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[slh1234]

Meanwhile, in the Pacific Northwest, we're having record rains for the year, and have people questioning whether we will have a summer this year. It was a very wet and somewhat cool spring in the Bay area before I moved, too. The latter was somewhat confusing to me because this was supposed to be a la Nina year which I thought produced cool and dry weather in California, but I heard people crediting la Nina for all the rain we were having. I think it's just a matter of whatever is convenient as an explanation.

Edit: Obviously, I'm new to living in the Pacific Northwest. My perception prior to moving here was that it was always like it is now. I'm posting mostly about the perception of people I talk to from here. Looking at data, it looks cool overall, but not anything people would normally get too excited about. We have gotten more rain than average, but it doesn't look like the "120 year high" like I've heard claimed.

Edit on 7/20/2011: From a local TV station on how much summer weather we've had in Seattle thus far this year:

www.komonews.com/weather/blogs/scott/125742443.html

[w7psk]

Jul 19, 2011 8:05:08 GMT scpg02 said:

However, it will take months if not years for scientists to determine whether climate change has played a role in turning up the heat so far this summer, and in this heat wave specifically.

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In other words we need to MILK the free money so we will just say it takes years of research, there for guaranteeing years of grants.

[rippleeffect]

I see they've totally forgotten the cold winter that was in the same area just a few months back. There were a couple of all time record lows for States if I'm not mistaken

[donmartin]

57 temperature records; and just exactly what is this measurement called "heat indices?" In the winter do we have "coldness indices?" What would that measure? Where do I find an historical record of heat indices for the United States?

[slh1234]

Jul 20, 2011 6:12:28 GMT donmartin said:

57 temperature records; and just exactly what is this measurement called "heat indices?" In the winter do we have "coldness indices?" What would that measure? Where do I find an historical record of heat indices for the United States?

Such things as "wind chill" or in some parts of the US: Chill Factor might be considered the winter equivalent. I think I've heard "Heat index" used at least since sometime in the 1980s.

Heat Index: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_index

Chill Factor: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chill_factor
Wind Chill: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_chill

They are relevant to how long you can stay explosed to the weather, or low much exertion you can tolerate.

I don't really know where you could find the actual records, but they could be calculated since temperature and humidity are recorded.

[slh1234]

Thinking again about your question ...

Some time ago, someone on here (I think it was Magellan) put forth the argument that temperature was a poor measure for warming because dry air does not contain as much heat as humid air. As such, it was an incorrect method to weight temperature measures from arid areas such as Arizona equally against temperature measures from places like the Gulf Coast of the US. I think he was comparing more the relatively dry air from high lattitudes with the relatively humid air of the tropics.

His argument makes sense to me. In the case of heat index, it may be the beginning of a way to measure heat content of the air. The main problem is that nobody concerns themselves with heat index until it is hot. . That would leave out the cooler measurements, but maybe it is the beginning of a way of measuring heat content of the air.

[numerouno]

Some time ago, someone on here (I think it was Magellan) put forth the argument that temperature was a poor measure for warming because dry air does not contain as much heat as humid air

Temperature is a poor measure for cooling, as well, then.

[slh1234]

Jul 20, 2011 16:44:17 GMT numerouno said:

Some time ago, someone on here (I think it was Magellan) put forth the argument that temperature was a poor measure for warming because dry air does not contain as much heat as humid air

Temperature is a poor measure for cooling, as well, then.

For the atmosphere, I agree that temperature alone is not a good measure for changes in either direction. If we can figure heat content, then that will be a much better measure.

[numerouno]

For the atmosphere, I agree that temperature alone is not a good measure for changes in either direction. If we can figure heat content, then that will be a much better measure.

My good man, why stop there. Heat content is one thing, but what makes things go about in the physical world is the energy differential. You may want to find the thermal energy available per volume, and of course that will be freely changeable in 3D plus time. Also make good note of any phase changes of water, mainly. Pretty soon you'll have - a full climate model!


Quite a bit of trouble to avoid mentioning the parameter of temperature.

[Pooh]

For personal reasons, I've been following temperatures in the United Kingdom. (I have a family spy there.)

I ran across a graph showing the daily high temperatures were bouncing a bit above the average low temperature. And it has been raining, raining, raining.

What I've not been able to find is the path of the jet stream over the North Atlantic and a map of the pressure systems therein.

The last time we had an outstanding anomaly in this neck of the woods there was a blocking pattern in the Atlantic. But, in that case, it was anomalous cold.

[slh1234]

Jul 20, 2011 18:30:10 GMT numerouno said:

For the atmosphere, I agree that temperature alone is not a good measure for changes in either direction. If we can figure heat content, then that will be a much better measure.

My good man, why stop there. Heat content is one thing, but what makes things go about in the physical world is the energy differential. You may want to find the thermal energy available per volume, and of course that will be freely changeable in 3D plus time. Also make good note of any phase changes of water, mainly. Pretty soon you'll have - a full climate model!


Quite a bit of trouble to avoid mentioning the parameter of temperature.

Okay, I got lost somewhere and don't get your point. I'm not trying to avoid mentioning temperature, I'm pointing out that I thought someone made a good argument about heat content not always being reflected in temperature for some of the reasons you mentioned. I'm thinking that more as we talk more and more about ocean heat content, but I think ocean heat content may be more relevant to any warming discussion than atmospheric heat content just because it would seem to hold a lot more heat.

Where are we taking issue?

[sigurdur]

numerouno was trying to inject an issue to start people thinking.

I am sure his post was not contentious and was meant in a good thought provoking way.

As far as a climate model that is useful, he suggested one parameter that is not in climate models now with any degree of certainty.

I think he was encouraging you to make a scientific breakthrough.

[slh1234]

Jul 20, 2011 22:22:13 GMT sigurdur said:

numerouno was trying to inject an issue to start people thinking.

I am sure his post was not contentious and was meant in a good thought provoking way.

As far as a climate model that is useful, he suggested one parameter that is not in climate models now with any degree of certainty.

I think he was encouraging you to make a scientific breakthrough.

That's fine if that was his point. I was really meaning to say I didn't understand what he meant.

While interesting, I don't think any scientific breakthrough in that area will be mine. I'm just trying to think about it.

[numerouno]

Slh1234, what you call "heat content" is insignificant in itself. It will not do work. A candle is a heat reservoir, but will only do useful work when you set it alight. What drives the atmosphere are the temperature, gravity and pressure differentials, not a static heat content.

These parameters are actually being recorded for you by your (national) weather services, as they will be needed in making the weather forecasts.