You will notice that in Spencers thought experiment that you provided the link for Spencer had a heated metal block.
You will also notice that the diagram is labeled Spencers thought experiment
What is your point?
The thread started with you arguing a point exactly as Magellan is saying you argued it. Magellan said if you throw a blanket over a dead body it does not warm. You started this thousand post argument because you claimed Magellan was wrong. Some 100 posts into the argument, after Magellan had humored you with experiments, you realized you were wrong, changed the goal posts and erased a 100 or more of your posts claiming it was to cleanse your mind.
Right I agree it was to cleanse your mind. . . .as you obviously thought your own words were harmful to you.
Bullshit
Feb 10, 2012 at 6:38am icefisher said:
The problem with backradiation as a concept is it is required to warm something warmer than what it is now.
Feb 10, 2012 at 9:45am iceskater said:
You often say that kind of thing. Seems wrong to me. The earth is already warm and it is continually cooling.
The atmosphere prevents the earth from cooling as much as it would do if the atmosphere was not present
Feb 10, 2012 at 5:34pm
Pardon the simplistic analogy, but I'm not getting the part where a warm body can be warmed further by a cooler body. Yes I've read both sides of the subject, but having looked for real world experimental evidence, something doesn't add up.
Feb 10, 2012 at 8:54pm iceskater said:
You seem determined to ignore my observations that the backradiation influence is related to insulation of the earth rather than some kind of magic heat generation as you and Magellen keep claiming.
Feb 10, 2012 at 10:41pm Magellan said
You gave no observations, just opinions.
Feb 11, 2012 at 3:20pm magellan said:
Yes, Virginia, Cooler Objects Can Make Warmer Objects Even Warmer Still
If you agree with Roy Spencer, you're wrong,
Feb 11, 2012 at 10:55pm iceskater said:
Spencer is using ideas established since before 1850 at least.
However Spencer could have made it clearer by drawing something like this.
Feb 18, 2012 at 1:05pm iceskater said:
Magellan this is a
radiation experiment. If you place a hot metal ring on a cold piece of granite the heat from the metal will conduct into the granite and rapidly cool the metal.
The metal plate cannot get warm until the granite is warmer than the furnace walls. So i have no idea what you actually did as you have not given temperature information about the granite or furnace walls.
Feb 22, 2012 at 5:22pm Iceskater said
Here is a simple experiment demonstrating back-radiation
The left hand plate is heated from behind by a light bulb to about 59C.
The wall on the right is around 16.5C
The moveable plate is 30-35C
So the hot plate is analogous to the earths surface
the warm plate is analogous to the earths atmosphere as an absorber/emitter when it is present and as a non-absorber/emitter when it is not there.
The wall is analogous to outer space
Feb 22, 2012 at 5:36pm Iceskater
The problem i am having with icefisher is his understanding of thermodynamic laws where he says backradiation does work for nothing.
Why he says that work is done for nothing is a mystery to me.
Backradiation can only be possible during cooling, where a heated object is continually cooling, or an object that is not heated just cools till it reaches equilibrium
So climate backradiation happens when the earth is rising in temperature, is stable or is cooling and happens regardless of the temperature of the atmosphere
Nothing gets gained for nothing.
Magellan Feb 23, 2012 at 3:31pm
The setup:
1) Cooper-Atkins 3 channel thermometer w/1075 puncture probes
2) 2-Fluke 87v DMM w/80BK-A contact bead probe
3) 2- ~.67" thick x 3.67" dia. steel disks. All face surfaces have been ground to ~32 micro finish.
Iceskater Feb 23, 2012 at 9:44pm
1. I think though,
you have fundamentally misunderstood the experiment you have to construct or what you are looking for?
2. You said: Iceskater said the warmer part would be warmed further by the colder part during the cooling process
What I said or at least was doing my best to convey when it is not so easy to put into words was:
When the warm object 1, is cooling, 1 will be warmer on the surface where it is near a cooler object 2 , where otherwise/elsewhere, 1 will be exposed to the fewer emissions coming from a very much colder surface 3. So three surfaces were involved of 1 = Warm, 2 = cooler and 3 = very cold.
Feb 26, 2012 at 9:21am Magellan said
You need to explain why the atmosphere is not warming as climate models predicted based on what you folks continually regurgitate as "
basic physics".
Feb 26, 2012 at 9:52am iceskater said:
the following chart shows 'Heat loss from a heated surface to unheated surroundings with mean radiant temperatures'
Net radiative heat losses from a 140C surface to a 20C room temperature surfaces are 1250 WM2
Net radiative Heat losses from a 140C surface to a surface at 30C are 1100 WM2
Obviously a cooling block will warm a nearby object and lose less heat and therefore be cooler on the surfaces further away from the warmer environment.
Feb 26, 2012 at 10:49am magellan said:
That wasn't your argument Iceskater. Stop rewriting history, and deleting it.
Your argument was just as my controlled experiment demonstrated; you didn't know what you were talking about. I already knew what the results would be.
Feb 26, 2012 at 11:36am Iceskater said
Magellan
You need to calm down and stop this nonesense
My experiment was always the same experiment.
A hotter block cooling, near a warm block and a cooler environment.
Post by iceskater on Feb 26, 2012 at 12:12pm
Signurdur
I am sorry, you are not helping.
Magellan needs to recognise that I have been saying the same thing now for almost a month
as embodied by these three pictures
1.
basic physics2. My experiments
3. Spencers thought experiment
Mar 13, 2012 at 8:08pm iceskater said:
As i have already demonstrated if an object is warmed and then placed in air, the surface is colder than the interior and therefore the interior heats the surface.
When the blanket is placed around the object the surface layer will rise in temperature until the various heating and cooling forces are in balance.
The same would apply to a recently deceased dead body which had been cooling in the same kind of uninsulated environment prior to the blanket being placed.Mar 14, 2012 at 2:11pm magellan said
I don't have a manikin so this probably won't meet your demand for a qualified test. However, I still have my disc friend and he is deader than a door nail I assure you.I had to find a retired indian physics professor to get you guys to grasp reality where you could not even understand why the surface of a hot egg gets hotter once you stop blowing on it.